The Intersection of Poetry and Art: Reflections on Conjunction
In this episode, we chat with artists Nala Ward and Emily Collins about their collaborative exhibition, Conjunction. Their partnership started with a strong friendship and a shared respect for each other's work. We dive into the themes of growth, self-acceptance, and how poetry and collage come together in their creative process. Nala’s poetry and Emily’s visuals create a unique conversation between words and imagery. They also share what it was like to showcase their work in an unconventional space, the challenges they faced, and the sense of community that came out of it. Enjoy!
Follow Emily @energy.em and Nala @grungeleslieknope to see more of their work!
Mentioned in this episode:
Joe Bean Roasters
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Punches & Popcorn
The masters of Couch Potato style Mike Huntone, Jason Bills, and Dr. Dominic D’Amore take a deep dive into the best and worst of martial arts films. https://punches-and-popcorn.captivate.fm/
Lunchador Podcast Network
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Transcript
Welcome back to behind the Studio Door.
Speaker A:Hello, I'm your host, Molly Darling, along with my co host who's actually here today, Christian Rivera.
Speaker B:Just be swooping in from the skies.
Speaker A:You truly never know what to expect.
Speaker B:I've been in the skies for three weeks and I decided now it's time to land and sit in front of a microphone.
Speaker B:And I'm here, I'm ready.
Speaker B:I'm a professional.
Speaker B:That was my transforming into a human sound.
Speaker B:So I'm ready.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:And that was Chris Lindstrom coming in from the back curtain.
Speaker C:Oh, the snow is melting.
Speaker C:In theory, we might not have winter forever.
Speaker C:I'm not quite sure.
Speaker B:I mean, I talked to the groundhog a few weeks ago and he was like, screw you guys, I'm going home.
Speaker B:And I don't know what that meant.
Speaker C:Yeah, fair enough.
Speaker B:It could mean winter forever.
Speaker A:Yeah, there's a.
Speaker A:There's like a bunny trail.
Speaker A:I could go on with a trivia question we had a couple weeks ago about the groundhog, but I don't want to talk about it, so I'm going to introduce our guests.
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker A:Also on my trivia team, we have return podcast guests.
Speaker A:Today on behind the Studio Door, we have Nala Ward and Emily Collins.
Speaker A:And we brought them back on the show because was October right of last year, November, November.
Speaker A:You guys did a really phenomenal collaborative exhibition called Conjunction.
Speaker A:And you also made a zine about it, which I'm holding in my hands and I'm going to read your intros and then we'll get into it.
Speaker A:About this collaboration, I'm super excited.
Speaker A:So we've got Nala, who is a multi talented creative originating from Bronx, New York.
Speaker A:Whether working with poetry, photography, or collage, Nala's work is deeply influenced by their love of harmony and the rich tapestry of collective human experiences.
Speaker A:And the lovely Emily Collins is a multidisciplinary artist, writer and educator from Rochester, N.Y.
Speaker A:through mixed media collage, she explores topics such as introspection, the poignancy of the human experience, and the many facets of womanhood and the interconnectedness of everything.
Speaker A:Hello, Pisces season.
Speaker A:Welcome to the show again, Emily and Nala.
Speaker A:How are you lovely humans doing this evening?
Speaker D:I'm hanging in.
Speaker E:We are here.
Speaker E:We're here.
Speaker B:You have arrived.
Speaker D:We've arrived.
Speaker E:We're alive, awake, alert, enthusiastic.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Were you gonna sing that?
Speaker A:That was like a alive, awake, alert, enthusiastic.
Speaker A:Yay.
Speaker A:We're all like very low energy.
Speaker A:It's like the middle of winter time and let's crank it up all Right.
Speaker C:Now we're ready for the podcast.
Speaker B:Everybody get together.
Speaker B:We're gonna talk about Conjunction.
Speaker B:Conjunction, what's your function?
Speaker B:I said it out loud.
Speaker A:It's gonna happen.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker B:We're blowing out microphones here on this very poetic podcast.
Speaker C:Let's go.
Speaker A:So speaking of Conjunction.
Speaker B:Into the darkness.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Thank you for that.
Speaker A:He now will not speak for the next 35 minutes.
Speaker A:Probably correct.
Speaker A:But so, Conjunction, I would love if you guys would talk about where the idea came from, you know, how the evolution of this thing came to be.
Speaker A:What is Conjunction?
Speaker A:Why Conjunction?
Speaker D:Why Conjunction?
Speaker E:Where?
Speaker D:Conjunction.
Speaker E:How?
Speaker D:Conjunction.
Speaker A:Who?
Speaker D:Who.
Speaker E:I think we got the who.
Speaker E:Maybe we do the how.
Speaker D:So, yes, the who is me and Emily.
Speaker D:The how.
Speaker D:Honestly, Emily had been.
Speaker D:Or I'll tell it.
Speaker D:But you'd been a fan of my poetry for a little bit, and then we just got to talking about stuff, growing a close friendship, and now we're like, what if we did a zine?
Speaker D:Let's, like, collab.
Speaker D:And that was probably in, like, January.
Speaker D: No, February: Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker D:And then I'm like, yeah, okay, let's do it.
Speaker D:I have a bunch of poems, you know, just honestly not even thinking that it was gonna happen.
Speaker D:Like, here.
Speaker D:Here is all of the poems, and Emily loved them and crafted a story out of them in a way that I hadn't even foreseen.
Speaker D:And that's where we started.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:I had happened upon Nala's poetry in some group shows year few years back now and said to you, Molly, you know, I love this poetry.
Speaker E:And you were like, this is one of my best friends, Nala.
Speaker E:You would love her.
Speaker A:You totally would.
Speaker E:And you were right.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:And so it was around, I think, this time last year that I was like, what if?
Speaker E:Yeah, right.
Speaker D:Happy 2 22.
Speaker E:Oh.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:2 22.
Speaker A:All the angel numbers.
Speaker A:This is the right day for us to see recording.
Speaker E:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker E:But, yeah, no, just that I said, you know, what if.
Speaker E:How would you feel if I maybe made some collages to your poetry?
Speaker E:And you.
Speaker E:Nala, said, yeah, let's do it.
Speaker E:Here, I'll send you some and choose what you like and leave the rest.
Speaker E:And I liked them all.
Speaker E:So then, yeah, I did kind of see that there could maybe be a narrative thread kind of going through the poetry.
Speaker E:And so that's kind of how we started.
Speaker E:We sat down together, and I had kind of had some thoughts after reading the poetry, and it was really fun.
Speaker E:We had everything printed out, and we kind of started moving things around a little bit and kind of putting things in different order and talking about what kind of story that might tell depending on the order of the poetry.
Speaker E:And that was sort of how the story started.
Speaker E:And then the zine kind of came out of a logistical matter of how do we put all these words on top of collage, which my collages are traditionally pretty busy in and of themselves.
Speaker E:How do we make that all shine, both of us, without overpowering one or the other?
Speaker E:And that's kind of where this booklet the Scene came out of.
Speaker E:And then it kind of became a bigger project from that, you know?
Speaker E:Cause then we wanted.
Speaker E:Needed to celebrate it in some way.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:And we needed to show it.
Speaker A:And then you guys had a whole show, like an exhibition in the place where we play trivia.
Speaker D:Sure did.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker A:Dragonfly Tavern.
Speaker A:Heck yes.
Speaker D:Yes.
Speaker D:They were gracious enough to let us do a one night only show at the bar on a Friday.
Speaker A:That's amazing.
Speaker A:And they had like a special drink and everything, right?
Speaker D:Yeah, Special drink, cocktails, mocktails after the poem title.
Speaker A:I love that.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:Love, love the staff there.
Speaker A:Yeah, they're fantastic.
Speaker A:I'm wondering about.
Speaker A:You guys were talking about themes that emerged as you were collaborating together.
Speaker A:What were the themes that started to emerge and what was the story that began to unfold?
Speaker A:Let's dig deeper into that.
Speaker D:So honestly, the story that kind of unfolded through just putting all of the poems together, I guess I can also let you talk about it, but I feel like it was more so just like a story of.
Speaker D:A story of growth, evolution coming out of my shell and like some kind of acceptance story there.
Speaker D:Does that hit the nail on the head?
Speaker D:How did it happen for you?
Speaker E:Yeah, I mean, I think ultimately it is.
Speaker E:It's your story.
Speaker E:It's the poems for you, and correct me if I'm wrong, but are relatively like narrative of your life.
Speaker E:They're discussing things that you experience in.
Speaker E:In metaphors or.
Speaker E:And whatnot.
Speaker E:But you're drawing from your life's experience to.
Speaker E:To fuel the poetry, the writing.
Speaker E:Right.
Speaker E:And I.
Speaker D:Absolutely.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:Sorry.
Speaker D:Oh no, you're totally fine.
Speaker D:I was just completely agreeing.
Speaker D:But yeah, it is a lot of.
Speaker D:And even like with my writing comes from a lot of life experience or just being so fed up with something that it needs to come out kind of thing.
Speaker B:Is there anything you're willing to get into the nitty gritty about, like, about what particular a particular poem might mean for you in that journey to acceptance.
Speaker E:Christian's trying to get.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it would also totally be fine if you wanted to read One of your poems out loud to us.
Speaker B:I carry a shovel everywhere I go, and I like to dig deep.
Speaker D:Love to dig deep.
Speaker D:This one, I.
Speaker D:I guess I.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:Because you were saying if I wanted to read a poem.
Speaker D:So the.
Speaker D:The first one, Puzzled, Honestly, I could talk about that one.
Speaker D:It encompasses a lot, but would you want me to read it?
Speaker A:Yes, because that was the one that.
Speaker A:If you weren't going to read it, I was going to read it.
Speaker D:Okay.
Speaker A:Definitely my favorite.
Speaker A:Ooh.
Speaker D:Okay.
Speaker D:Nice.
Speaker D:So, yeah, this is the first poem in the zine called Puzzled.
Speaker D:I've perfected the magic of piecing people back together, while I myself remain scattered.
Speaker D:That's the problem with seeing the big picture alone.
Speaker D:You accept yourself as a smaller piece than you actually are.
Speaker D:Sometimes you're much bigger.
Speaker D:And that was Puzzled.
Speaker A:Heck, yeah.
Speaker D:And honestly, I feel like I just been coming out of.
Speaker D:And just having to continually come out of this.
Speaker D:Like, I hate using or even saying the word, but like, people pleasing, like, mode of life.
Speaker E:And.
Speaker D:Yeah, I just felt like all of my peacekeeping ways were no longer serving me and serving everyone else.
Speaker D:So, yeah, that was a whole stage of life.
Speaker D:And that.
Speaker D:That's the.
Speaker D:That's the point A, though.
Speaker D:And I'm already past the point Z of this zine.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker D:I should say.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So that lives on that page.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:At this point, it feels like you're.
Speaker B:You're moving on from that where you feel like you're still wrestling with that stuff.
Speaker D:I do.
Speaker D:Honestly, I do still feel like I wrestle with it.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:I feel like I still get myself in trouble by not listening to my intuition.
Speaker D:But it's.
Speaker D:That's what it's about.
Speaker D:It's a practice, it's growing, it's evolutionary.
Speaker D:Sometimes it's a conjunction.
Speaker D:It just happens out of nowhere for a little while.
Speaker B:So it's like.
Speaker B:Am I reading correctly?
Speaker B:When you're using the word conjunction that way, you're like.
Speaker B:It's like a serendipity almost kind of vibe.
Speaker B:Like everything's coming together.
Speaker B:It's sort of like.
Speaker B:I mean, you talk about these.
Speaker A:I have a definition.
Speaker A:You point out here in the Z.
Speaker B:I understand, but I'm going for interpretation.
Speaker A:No, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.
Speaker B:But you're talking about.
Speaker B:I mean, for knowing you personally, you're the one that catches the angel numbers always.
Speaker B:It's like you're attuned to the serendipitous moments, at least right now in your life.
Speaker B:And so it feels like you're trying to hone your intuition, your Knowing your inner knowing.
Speaker B:To look for these moments of passage, of.
Speaker B:Of when you're moving from one space to the next.
Speaker B:If I'm reading that correctly and reinterpreting that correctly.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker B:Question mark.
Speaker D:I would.
Speaker D:I would agree with that.
Speaker D:And I.
Speaker D:I would also add on to it that I also feel like it's been a part of, like, reclaiming some power.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:In the sense of, like, okay, like, I already have a feeling about this, and I can either just do what I've always done or make this correction and be better off.
Speaker D:And I feel like I'm just.
Speaker D:That's kind of what the conjunction is.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I'm also curious, like, Emily, what your take on that poem is.
Speaker B:Like, how does it.
Speaker B:How do you interpret, like.
Speaker B:Like Nala's interpretation of it?
Speaker B:Like, how do you see her going through this phase?
Speaker B:And, like, how does it hit you?
Speaker E:Well, I think one of the main things that has always drawn me to Nala's poetry is that I really relate to it myself personally as well.
Speaker E:You know, we're basically the same age.
Speaker E:We graduated the same year, so we're, you know, age cohorts.
Speaker E:We are in, you know, similar places in our lives.
Speaker E:So, you know, I found Nala's words just speaking about her honest experience in interacting with others and trying to find self through relationship with others in the world and holding onto your, you know, forming and holding onto your identity while navigating those waters and figuring out how you.
Speaker E:Where you fit in the world.
Speaker E:Like, I'm right there, too, so I totally relate to that.
Speaker E:And I think that as we got into this project, we felt like there was something there that a lot of people can relate to.
Speaker E:You know, we're speaking to people, I think, who are, you know, are in a similar place in their life or in their personal development journeys, perhaps.
Speaker E:And I think that.
Speaker E:Yeah, like, Nala's talking about, there's.
Speaker E:Or perhaps too Christian, like, what you were alluding to, that there's.
Speaker E:Through doing a project like this, there is some sort of catharsis or it feels right to put out your feelings into the world of.
Speaker E:I'm experiencing this, and this is what I'm learning from it, and this is what I'm grappling with.
Speaker E:From it or with it.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:I think that there's some value to doing that and opening space up for those conversations to happen.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker B:Great.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Were there any, like, moments of synergy between the collages and the poems or, like, anything that was kind of unexpected and a surprise in the process as you were processing.
Speaker D:I will say so.
Speaker D:I definitely trusted Emily with the process of making the collages.
Speaker D:Like, she is a talented collage artist, and I knew that she would bring some justice to it.
Speaker D:And she was also open to any of my input, any things that I was visualizing and all that.
Speaker D:I would say.
Speaker D:I don't think we have it printed in the scene.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:But there was the poem or.
Speaker D:Sorry, the collage for the poem.
Speaker D:Going outside and touching grass.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker E:Which is.
Speaker D:Pause this.
Speaker D:Which is that one.
Speaker E:Which one are you thinking about?
Speaker D:Pause.
Speaker D:I believe I am thinking about.
Speaker D:Where's the one?
Speaker D:I think it was Greeting card.
Speaker B:Because this is the ASMR section, by the way.
Speaker D:Yes.
Speaker D:Doing some page.
Speaker C:I really thought you were telling me to pause the recording.
Speaker A:Oh, no.
Speaker A:Did you.
Speaker A:No, stop it.
Speaker B:No, we don't do that here.
Speaker B:We let the madness unfold.
Speaker A:So the only positive.
Speaker A:I say pause there.
Speaker D:There we go.
Speaker E:Yes.
Speaker D:I was not giving instruction.
Speaker D:I'm trying to.
Speaker D:Okay, so I'll just tell you the one that I'm thinking of.
Speaker D:It's the collage you made with the, like, different TV screens and cameras that have, like, that.
Speaker E:That is the one for Puzzled.
Speaker D:Oh, that is for puzzles.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:So the zine has some of the collages in full within, but not all of them.
Speaker E:There are all of the visual elements in the zine come from the collages.
Speaker E:And that might be something we could talk about.
Speaker E:But.
Speaker E:Yeah, so when Nala's flipping through, it's because the zine contains a few spreads with, you know, images.
Speaker E:But there were.
Speaker E:Each poem got a full image.
Speaker E:However, not every single image is inside the zine.
Speaker B:Can we talk through, like, what the visual for puzzle looks like and what it means?
Speaker B:Maybe not what it means, but, like, I guess, interpretation of it for.
Speaker D:Yeah, for me, I just enjoyed the fact that.
Speaker D:And it was, like, different, like, small, like.
Speaker D:Like stars and galaxies that you put into the different, like, TV screens and photo screens.
Speaker D:I just really.
Speaker D:It's just something that I wasn't, like, envisioning when I wrote it also.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:Just the whole process of Emily interpreting my poetry into her style of art was just so wild to see because, like, it's not that I don't agree with it.
Speaker D:I feel like it's completely the vibe of the poems and, like, the messages I'm trying to get across in the poems, but then seeing it through someone else's eyes is always just so cool.
Speaker B:So when you see, like, puzzled in the work that comes from that, does it reflect something new about yourself to you, to have someone else interpret it, to see, you know, the galaxies on the screens and like, sort of look at what is her interpretation and like, what is.
Speaker B:What is she seeing about me in this moment that I'm probably not seeing about myself?
Speaker B:Does that come through?
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:So, yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head because it's more so like it's something that I wasn't seeing in myself during the peak time of when I was just, you know, really deep into, I guess, you know, putting myself aside and putting other people in front of my needs.
Speaker D:And I feel like even at that time in my life, I've had like a.
Speaker D:I felt like I've had just like a connection to my intuition, but I wasn't even thinking about it being valid or useful to me.
Speaker D:So it was just wild to see that.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:Because it's not what I would have seen during that time in my life or what I was picturing or.
Speaker D:But it's exactly what I was like feeling.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So it felt like maybe Emily found a way to mirror visually, like the, the internal experiences that you were having that you wouldn't have necessarily thought of using that kind of imagery for.
Speaker D:Right.
Speaker A:Which I felt like made the show really special.
Speaker A:Like, all of the pieces that you made, Emily, like, were there certain words or emotions or themes that really like pulled on your heartstrings from the jump when you were working on these collages or how did that process unfold for you of creating the visuals from Nala's words?
Speaker E:Yeah, I really just tried.
Speaker E:I really wanted to channel the feeling of the poem into a visual that would also evoke the same feeling.
Speaker E:Like looking at it would tell that same kind of emotional story.
Speaker E:I'm not very logic minded when it comes to making the art.
Speaker E:I don't know, at least in this way, I just, I want.
Speaker E:I.
Speaker E:I read the poems and I felt the poems because that's.
Speaker E:If you are into poetry, you get that, you know, you have to read.
Speaker A:Them aloud and then let them sink into your DNA.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:And read them over again.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker E:You know, and.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:And kind of just feel what.
Speaker E:What they feel and then try to put that into.
Speaker E:Channel that into what the.
Speaker E:What the art looks like.
Speaker E:So, you know, the collages are oftentimes very busy because I'm trying to kind of pull people into them.
Speaker E:You know, I think it.
Speaker E:What I'm going for a lot of the time is I get this reaction of like, people at first are like, I don't Know what I'm looking at.
Speaker E:And then, and then they look at it some more like, whoa, I'm seeing this and I'm seeing that, I'm seeing that.
Speaker E:And there's symbolism in there.
Speaker E:And I talked about that on this podcast before about putting symbolism into the work.
Speaker E:And I kind of just mention it vaguely because it's open to interpretation.
Speaker E:But yeah, everything is symbolic.
Speaker E:You know, for the example with the Puzzled, you know, at first I have like post it notes written all over the place with just kind of words jotted down of different things that came to me while I was reading the poems.
Speaker E:And some of those things ended up becoming the piece like being like a tree I wrote, you know, person coming out of tree, going into tree.
Speaker E:And that is kind of what happened.
Speaker E:But then other pieces, like for example, Puzzled.
Speaker E:I think at first I did try to visualize somebody like kind of.
Speaker E:I was trying to kind of make it meta, like somebody collaging somebody, you know, kind of a thing.
Speaker E:But then I'm limited to by what I can find.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So, you know, collage is a wild medium that way.
Speaker A:You're like, oh, I'm literally going to use whatever images I can find and cut together.
Speaker A:Which I think puts some really interesting constraints on this project.
Speaker A:And we're going to take a quick break and we'll be right back to dive into that.
Speaker A:So we're talking about collage and poetry with Nala and Emily.
Speaker A:And Emily, you were talking about how interesting it is to have that construction with collage, to just be able to use what you can find.
Speaker A:And so tell me a little bit more about that process with, you know, the collage that you were talking about with Puzzled with the TV screens and everything.
Speaker A:How did you come up with that idea?
Speaker A:Was it something that was just like process oriented, that came up naturally or how does that process look like for you?
Speaker E:Yeah, well, like I was saying before, you're limited kind of by what you can find.
Speaker E:And you certainly can find something that you're looking for if you have the time to flip endlessly through and the patience and the desire to flip endlessly through things.
Speaker E:But for me, I get to a point where I'm like, I've flipped through enough and I'm going to use what I can, what I found here.
Speaker E:And you know, for things like Puzzled and some of the other pieces that kind of came together sort of, you know, things kind of come together in a flurry towards the end, not like a deadline, you.
Speaker E:And that's why you'll find some of the pieces in the zine and some not.
Speaker E:Yeah, things change because you're working with what you have, and that's how Found Object, you know, assemblage or whatever works.
Speaker E:But that was a big part, too, of, you know, the.
Speaker E:The collaboration where we were getting together and sitting down and talking about things and working on things and moving things around was.
Speaker E:We got together a few times and, like, went through stuff, you know.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:What was that process like?
Speaker A:Because, Nala, have you collaborated on collage stuff before, or was this the first time?
Speaker D:Yeah, this would have been the first time collaborating with collage things.
Speaker D:But, yeah, it was a fun time.
Speaker D:Going over a couple nights, flipping through some zines, started taking things out for other things, and, you know, you get the other ideas from what you're seeing too, so.
Speaker D:But, yeah, it was a good time.
Speaker D:And Emily has a vast collection of varying styles of magazines.
Speaker A:I love how you guys are trying so hard to not say porn.
Speaker A:Well, I was gonna say, like, is it.
Speaker C:Is it mostly, like, Highlights magazine?
Speaker A:What are the magazines?
Speaker C:Natural, National Geographic, Status Magazine?
Speaker D:Well, we wanted.
Speaker E:We wanted this to have a little bite to it.
Speaker E:You know, we wanted.
Speaker E:The more we got into the project, and it kind of started to take on a life for itself, as I think every art piece does.
Speaker E:It has its own kind of spirit or whatever that comes out as the project goes on.
Speaker E:And we wanted it to be a little bit edgy.
Speaker E:We wanted it to be like, you know, we're not gonna be nice.
Speaker E:We're gonna talk about the things that are pissing us off and the people that are pissing us off, and we're gonna have an art party at a bar, and we're just gonna, you know, come or don't screw you.
Speaker A:It's gonna be Scorpio themed, which.
Speaker A:I'm so sorry, so sorry.
Speaker A:If you weren't there, you weren't there.
Speaker A:I am so sorry I was not there.
Speaker D:Almost forgot about that.
Speaker A:The Scorpio who did not show up to the Scorpio show.
Speaker A:But it, like, I really love the fact that your process together, like, that's the beauty of collaboration, right?
Speaker A:It's like you're taking two very different and similar people and, like, putting it into a soup of, like, oh, what's this third entity going to be like?
Speaker A:And the third entity of Conjunction seemed, like, really intriguing and spicy, but also, like, real and vulnerable and raw.
Speaker A:And the poetry, plus the collage, felt to me like genuine expression of, like, especially, like, someone who has that feminine rage also, you know, or, you know, all kinds of feelings I feel like you expressed in this work, so.
Speaker E:I love feminine rage.
Speaker A:Me too.
Speaker D:Oh, yeah.
Speaker E:I want to.
Speaker E:I want to just make art about it forever.
Speaker E:I don't know.
Speaker E:I don't know if it's.
Speaker E:You don't want to be enraged forever, but it's a.
Speaker E:It's a.
Speaker E:It's a real experience of being a human, you know?
Speaker B:Well, you were talking about not people pleasing, and it feels like if the rage part is new, it's like a novelty thing.
Speaker B:Also, you're just excited to be angry almost.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Well.
Speaker A:And I think for a lot of people that are socialized as women, we're, like, not allowed to feel rage.
Speaker A:And we don't feel rage.
Speaker A:We don't allow ourselves to feel rage for a long time.
Speaker A:And so now we're in this time in history and also in our lives personally, where we're just like this.
Speaker A:Like, I'm mad about these things, and I want to.
Speaker A:These things to be taken care of and these people to be taken care of, and they're not being taken care of.
Speaker A:And so it's like, of course we're mad, you know?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker D:And let the anger flow through you and take motion and turn into art.
Speaker D:And turn into art.
Speaker C:Thank you.
Speaker C:Thank you.
Speaker C:Emperor Nala from Star Wars.
Speaker D:Let the anger flow through.
Speaker C:I was kind of wondering from.
Speaker C:You know, because obviously you knew each other ahead of this.
Speaker C:What in the process was something that you learned about each other, you know, because that's a part of collaboration, too, is you learn something about the other person you might not have known before.
Speaker D:Mm.
Speaker D:I gotta say, I am just glad that Emily was someone that I was already cool with.
Speaker D:Not that it was a difficult process, but if we were just both a very chill, like, yeah, this will happen when it happens, or, oh, you don't have to do this.
Speaker D:And we're, like, not putting, like.
Speaker D:I just wasn't putting any pressure on anything.
Speaker D:And, you know, no hard deadlines with the process, except for this year and formulating things.
Speaker D:But it really just worked out that we were both, like, of the same mindset in terms of process and progress.
Speaker E:Yeah.
Speaker E:I think we were very proud of ourselves that we did it, because I don't know if you've had this experience, but I've certainly had this experience where I have started working on a project with a friend and, oh, you know, we're going to make this so great, and then we burn out and it doesn't ever happen.
Speaker E:And I've had that experience so many times that you know, to accomplish, to say we're going to do this thing and then actually do it.
Speaker E:And it was attended and we sold zines and we sold art and it was received and that felt good.
Speaker E:And it, it helps, I don't know, it helps me to feel like, oh, I can do things.
Speaker E:We did it.
Speaker E:We did the damn thing.
Speaker D:Hung it ourselves, secured the venue.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:What a wild ride that was in and of itself.
Speaker A:Yeah, I would love to hear about that and also congratulate you again on making a zine, making a show, making art.
Speaker A:Because that's a lot of like finishing.
Speaker D:That was a lot of stuff.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I feel like, at least for me, I don't know if this is true for you guys, but when I finish something, there's like a sense of self trust, like extra self trust that comes with it.
Speaker A:It like builds your confidence.
Speaker A:You're like, oh, like you said, I can do, I can do this stuff, maybe I could do more stuff, you know.
Speaker A:But tell me about the process of collaborating on putting an actual in person event together.
Speaker A:Because I know that there's a lot of moving parts and pieces that come with that that could be easier or more challenging than putting together the art itself.
Speaker A:So what was that process like?
Speaker E:Yeah, I, I think that Nala and I pushed, like we had a nice flow of.
Speaker E:There were times where I would be like, hey, da da da da da da.
Speaker E:All this stuff, you know, and, and then she'd be like, okay, we're doing it, you know.
Speaker E:And then there were other times where I would be like Virgo, Libra.
Speaker E:In a nutshell, you haven't heard anything for a while.
Speaker E:Hehe.
Speaker E:And she's like, so I've got the venue.
Speaker E:And I, I'm like, okay, now I gotta actually finish this because she's throwing a party.
Speaker E:So it's happening.
Speaker E:Yes.
Speaker D:And I was so excited to throw a party, getting the decorations.
Speaker D:It was so cute.
Speaker E:But it was also kind of this nice balancing between the two of us of contributing both energy and motivation and then also kind of knowledge from different backgrounds and, and then different connects because you know, you're not from Rochester but you've been here for quite a while.
Speaker E:And so this, the event came out of a lot of your, you know, just community connections.
Speaker E:Right?
Speaker D:Honestly?
Speaker D:Yeah, I would say that definitely.
Speaker D:I mean, yeah, I've been going to Trivia Dragonfly for I think three, four years at this point.
Speaker D:So it was so like welcoming and comforting to be like, hey, can we use this as a venue?
Speaker D:And like them not Think twice about trusting me with what I wanted to do in their space.
Speaker D:So, yeah, do enjoy the community building aspect, playing a part in all of this happening.
Speaker D:You know, whether it was you're a part of the negative story or you're a part of the triumph.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:I also thought it was really cool when you guys were first planning it, because something that we talk about in this podcast often is like, the Rochester art community itself and, like, how that.
Speaker A:What that looks like right now.
Speaker A:And I really loved that you guys didn't have it in, like, a typical art venue.
Speaker A:I do too, because there are certain places that we, we know and we love and we go to them on first Fridays and they're awesome.
Speaker A:But also it's, like, really exciting to have art in a place that you wouldn't expect it.
Speaker A:And then you get to see it in a different context.
Speaker D:You know, the conjunction is conjunctioning, collaboration, businesses and stuff.
Speaker B:Exposure for not only the artists, but for the, the business that maybe people wouldn't normally go to.
Speaker E:Yeah, it was partially, you know, we both dance in and out of this art space to varying degrees and feel varying degrees of being welcomed or not welcomed, you know, and.
Speaker E:Or being seen as legitimate or not.
Speaker E:And sometimes it's like, you know, we just kind of, we wanted to.
Speaker E:So much of this was a statement of, you know, I am gonna be who I am.
Speaker E:I, I, I, I love who I am.
Speaker E:I'm cool with who I am, regardless of any external factors.
Speaker E:And here I am, and I'm doing this here, you know, and so that was kind of also what we wanted to do with the event too.
Speaker D:Thank you for putting that so eloquently.
Speaker A:And you guys made it happen too.
Speaker A:You weren't like, a place, pick me, you know, so that we can make this happen.
Speaker A:I need someone to let me know that this can happen.
Speaker A:Like, almost waiting for permission, you guys just did it.
Speaker A:You're like, we're gonna do it here.
Speaker A:Great.
Speaker A:And we're doing it here, and this is what the decorations are gonna be, and this is what it's gonna look like.
Speaker A:And it was, like, powerful, and it.
Speaker E:Let us do some things that were cool and different.
Speaker E:Like, do, like, have craft cocktails that were, you know, themed after different poems.
Speaker E:And.
Speaker E:And that was a lot of Nala's doing and was really fun to watch and helped to assuage the existential dread of like, oh, God, we're doing this thing that.
Speaker E:Is anybody gonna come?
Speaker E:Is anybody gonna like it?
Speaker A:It's always the vulnerability of putting your art and Your work out there, you're like, oh, this could suck.
Speaker A:Or even worse, no one could react at all.
Speaker E:But we did.
Speaker E:I did feel like we had a good, you know, turn out, especially given, you know, it was like a rainy night, and it was awesome to be able to do it on a weekend night.
Speaker E:And that also doing it in the space that we did provide, it caused a lot of interesting experiences.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I was gonna ask, were there some memorable situations and reactions and experiences that you could recount?
Speaker B:What's up now?
Speaker D:Tell me what's happening you've been waiting for, Christian.
Speaker D:I.
Speaker D:Yeah, it's definitely a unique experience that comes with its own new challenges in putting art in a space that wasn't designed for art, with art in mind.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker D:Such as unplugging the dartboard, which is a very staple stable piece in the bar.
Speaker D:So, you know, not everyone was a fan of us being there.
Speaker E:But it's one of those big electronic.
Speaker B:Dart boards, right, If I remember correctly.
Speaker D:Oh, yeah.
Speaker D:But honestly, it.
Speaker B:And yeah, it's like, big arcade machine size.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker A:It's massive.
Speaker A:It's like floor to ceiling.
Speaker E:But.
Speaker E:But the thing was, it got so crazy that we had to take the art down because it was in danger of getting destroyed or disappearing, which we had been warned of, but I didn't really believe them.
Speaker E:They were like, you know, your stuff could walk.
Speaker E:It could walk.
Speaker A:What are you talking about?
Speaker E:And then I saw it.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker C:What's a couple.
Speaker C:What's a couple dart holes in a.
Speaker C:In a piece of art that carries your feelings?
Speaker B:Grow some legs and walk out.
Speaker B:Like the Hip to be square video or the little square legs and walks around.
Speaker B:Hip to be square.
Speaker D:We were there at the right time.
Speaker D:As soon as the clock struck nine, the carriage was a pumpkin, and we knew the conjunction was over.
Speaker D:And I'm so conjunction that it happened.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker D:I'm glad that it happened, and I'm glad that we got to respect the space that we were just borrowing and we were welcomed there.
Speaker D:And then we got out.
Speaker A:And you lived to tell about it.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker D:And I got some food, smoked a joint.
Speaker B:I'm sure there's some.
Speaker B:I'm sure there's some interesting lessons learned for hanging art in a bar.
Speaker B:Like, first of all, there's the dartboard, and maybe you could lean into that next time.
Speaker D:I did put balloons on it.
Speaker A:I did.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:And just, like, create art that's intended to be stabbed a lot.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:That would have been thoughts for the next one.
Speaker B:And then secondly, forward art.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And if you're Worried about.
Speaker A:Fit right in if you really get that rage out.
Speaker B:If you're worried about the art walking, just like, set booby traps on it or something.
Speaker D:Maybe just like a.
Speaker D:I love this interactive.
Speaker D:I am low key.
Speaker D:Working, working on.
Speaker D:Yeah.
Speaker B:For conjunction 2.0, I'm open for consultations.
Speaker C:That's why we call him Christian John Rambo Rivera.
Speaker B:Every once in a while I go, that's my machine gun sound.
Speaker B:You know, just so you know what that sounds like.
Speaker A:Yeah, totally.
Speaker B:Anyway, those are my ideas.
Speaker B:I'm available for consultation if you guys.
Speaker A:Need help for the next show or.
Speaker B:If anyone wants to create some weird art for weird locations.
Speaker A:Yeah, there you go.
Speaker A:So it sounds like.
Speaker A:Would you guys collaborate again?
Speaker E:I actually would love to do that.
Speaker E:I've been thinking about that.
Speaker E:Yeah, let's talk too.
Speaker A:Really, really cool.
Speaker D:All right.
Speaker A:And in the meantime, where can people find y'all?
Speaker A:On the Internet or elsewhere?
Speaker A:Follow your work.
Speaker D:You can find me on Instagram.com grunge Leslie.
Speaker D:Nope.
Speaker D:You can also find me on Twitch TV, Tuesdays and Saturdays.
Speaker D:Grunge Leslie notes.
Speaker A:It is a good time.
Speaker A:Highly recommend.
Speaker A:And you, Emily?
Speaker E:Yeah, Best place is Instagram Energy.
Speaker E:Em.
Speaker E:And up next, I'm gonna have a piece in the community show at the Yards Thaw.
Speaker E:So I'll have a piece in that.
Speaker E:And there might be some publication stuff coming in collaboration with some of those curators.
Speaker E:And I also have a solo show coming up in the spring at New Movement.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Shout out to Danielle and New Movement.
Speaker A:Well, thank you guys for coming on the show for a second time.
Speaker A:Yes, I'm sure there will be more.
Speaker A:If there's more collaboration.
Speaker B:I'm gonna bring my bar darts to.
Speaker A:All those shows just in case.
Speaker B:So I'm hoping there's work that I can stab too soon, Christian.
Speaker C:And if you want to actually learn more about Thaw, go to our sister show to behind the Studio Door, behind the Glass, where we interviewed the team from Thaw about that whole process.
Speaker C:So very interesting there.
Speaker C:Also want you to check out Nights and Weekends, our new music show.
Speaker C:That should be out by the time this is out.
Speaker C:Really excited to learn more about the Rochester music scene.
Speaker C:So thank you to tuning in for another episode of behind the Studio Door.
Speaker C:This has been a presentation of the Lunchadore podcast network.
Speaker C:When there's music inside of you, you know that someday it's gotta come through.
Speaker C:That's why we're here and we're telling you true.
Speaker C:We're coming out of our shells.
